Comments on: Classical liberal fail: privilege, not exclusivity, is the problem http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/ ACCESS ALL AREAS Tue, 16 Mar 2010 04:00:16 +0200 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Toban http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2721 Toban Tue, 23 Jun 2009 16:55:01 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2721 @Miko: That quote is taken out of context (a persistent error among libertarians). If you read the whole chapter, he is explicitly talking about the right of proprietary communities to establish rules and exclude people (i.e., private property rights). In fact, Hoppe quotes Rothbard to the effect that a libertarian society would be a "gorgeous mosaic" of communities with different levels of discrimination according to the preferences of those living there (p. 212 footnote 25). I have also confirmed with Hoppe that this is the correct interpretation. @Miko: That quote is taken out of context (a persistent error among libertarians). If you read the whole chapter, he is explicitly talking about the right of proprietary communities to establish rules and exclude people (i.e., private property rights). In fact, Hoppe quotes Rothbard to the effect that a libertarian society would be a “gorgeous mosaic” of communities with different levels of discrimination according to the preferences of those living there (p. 212 footnote 25).

I have also confirmed with Hoppe that this is the correct interpretation.

]]> By: Chris Lempa http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2706 Chris Lempa Tue, 23 Jun 2009 00:13:52 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2706 I emailed Mike a mea culpa and wanted to do so publicly as well. I read the post in a hurry. I still don't like Hoppe! I emailed Mike a mea culpa and wanted to do so publicly as well. I read the post in a hurry.

I still don’t like Hoppe!

]]> By: Mike Gogulski http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2699 Mike Gogulski Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:16:17 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2699 @Chris: The quote I included above isn't Hoppe's at all. It was written by Toban Wiebe. @Chris: The quote I included above isn’t Hoppe’s at all. It was written by Toban Wiebe.

]]> By: Chris Lempa http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2698 Chris Lempa Mon, 22 Jun 2009 13:01:05 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2698 Mike, I agree with you to a point. The problem with using Hoppe's argument for democracy v. monarchy is that his arguments are, to him, inter-related. Hoppe likes the idea of kings kicking deviants out of their realm. I'm not so sure that replacing a somewhat replaceable aggressor with a non-replaceable aggressor is a good idea. Mike,
I agree with you to a point. The problem with using Hoppe’s argument for democracy v. monarchy is that his arguments are, to him, inter-related. Hoppe likes the idea of kings kicking deviants out of their realm.

I’m not so sure that replacing a somewhat replaceable aggressor with a non-replaceable aggressor is a good idea.

]]> By: Mike Gogulski http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2694 Mike Gogulski Sun, 21 Jun 2009 21:03:53 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2694 *Shrug*. I'll find value where there is value, and cast aside rubbish, too, when I come across it. One needn't buy all of Hoppe's preferences to find the analysis of monarchy vs. democracy stimulating, and especially not to find value in Wiebe's quoted passage. *Shrug*. I’ll find value where there is value, and cast aside rubbish, too, when I come across it. One needn’t buy all of Hoppe’s preferences to find the analysis of monarchy vs. democracy stimulating, and especially not to find value in Wiebe’s quoted passage.

]]> By: Miko http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2693 Miko Sun, 21 Jun 2009 19:44:13 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2693 And then Hoppe says: <blockquote>They – the advocates of alternative, non-family and kin-centered lifestyles such as, for instance, individual hedonism, parasitism, nature-environment worship, homosexuality, or communism – will have to be physically removed from society, too, if one is to maintain a libertarian order.</blockquote> His talk on immigration is similar. Of course, nothing about removing the ruler-ruled distinction would imply that one group of people shouldn't be allowed to drive others off their property because the first group dislikes the values of the second group, right? Hoppe is a right-wing nut masquerading as a libertarian; a better name for his views is anarcho-feudalism: he wants to get rid of coercive government so that he and his group of elites can use intimidation and the existing inequalities created by previous state-granted privileges to "buy" all of the world's land and reduce the vast majority of humanity to serfs, all the while claiming moral purity since his creation of the most hideous government imaginable would be by completely "voluntary" means. And then Hoppe says:

They – the advocates of alternative, non-family and kin-centered lifestyles such as, for instance, individual hedonism, parasitism, nature-environment worship, homosexuality, or communism – will have to be physically removed from society, too, if one is to maintain a libertarian order.

His talk on immigration is similar. Of course, nothing about removing the ruler-ruled distinction would imply that one group of people shouldn’t be allowed to drive others off their property because the first group dislikes the values of the second group, right?

Hoppe is a right-wing nut masquerading as a libertarian; a better name for his views is anarcho-feudalism: he wants to get rid of coercive government so that he and his group of elites can use intimidation and the existing inequalities created by previous state-granted privileges to “buy” all of the world’s land and reduce the vast majority of humanity to serfs, all the while claiming moral purity since his creation of the most hideous government imaginable would be by completely “voluntary” means.

]]> By: Mike Gogulski http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2692 Mike Gogulski Sun, 21 Jun 2009 16:41:43 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2692 Ach, sorry for that! Fixed! Ach, sorry for that! Fixed!

]]> By: Toban http://www.nostate.com/2441/classical-liberal-fail-privilege-not-exclusivity-is-the-problem/comment-page-1/#comment-2691 Toban Sun, 21 Jun 2009 16:40:02 +0000 http://www.nostate.com/?p=2441#comment-2691 Thanks for the plug! (you spelled my name wrong though!) Thanks for the plug! (you spelled my name wrong though!)

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